the partae

When you were writing Belladonna (This Is How You Die), was there a moment where you realised the song had become something much bigger or darker than you originally intended?

Yes… Initially I was a bit scared of the song. I felt like it was too big for me. It felt like we’d created this beast. I was still working myself out as an artist at the time—not that I’m not still figuring that out—but I was very new to making music and I genuinely thought, shit, this is too big. The drums kicking in with that guitar riff were terrifying! It’s not remotely subtle in the least, and that’s scary!

Low-key now, fast forward to the present day, it’s the song I absolutely can’t wait to unleash live. I love that we went there with the sound and that I did it so early on in my career as well. I feel like Lady Gaga would totally approve though, I think, and that is enough for me!

The title feels both beautiful and unsettling. What made you decide to lean into that contrast rather than play it safe?

This is something I say a lot, but honestly it’s just intuition and wherever the muse chooses to take me at the time I’m writing. I’m a vessel and whatever comes through, that’s what I do. I sometimes have an idea, or sonically something can come to mind, and I can write four other songs on top of the same production and I’ll hate all of them. Then, at the end of the day, something will come over me and it’ll all go down the way it’s meant to, and that’s what I’ll record.

With this song, it actually did occur to me that it was unsettling, and I found that exciting.

Was there a particular scene, memory, or person that stayed in your mind throughout the writing process, even if it never made it directly into the lyrics?

Oh okay, straight to the tea! I mean… yes.

This first chapter of my story as an artist really follows an old relationship. Every song, in one way or another, is about that same story. It’s a very star-crossed, huge-heartbreak, to-the-death story that I’ll probably never truly quite get over.

I think the Whiteheart line is probably a good one to point out as something specific. There’s a bar in the city that I’d always venture to with the same person. We’d start our nights there and then end up at 100 different other places. I’ve not been back there since, to be honest. I’ve been in the vicinity of it, but I’ve never gone back. Same with the other bars from that time.

Usually though, I will say that if I am dying to say something in the lyrics that is true to the story, I will move heaven and earth to get it in there. So you’ll generally know from the lyrics—I don’t shy away from it.

What part of this song do you think listeners are most likely to misunderstand on a first listen?

You know, I generally leave it up to the listener to take what they want to take from each of my songs and have it mean something to them in their own way. I try not to correct or influence them on the lyrics.

I suppose something that can be misunderstood from my personal perspective is the intention behind the lyric, “this is how you die.” I’m not, in the literal sense, saying someone is going to “die.” It is a metaphor. Death is something I talk about a lot in my songs, and sometimes it is a double entendre or a metaphor for something else.

Every release teaches an artist something. What did Belladonna (This Is How You Die) teach you about yourself as a songwriter?

To be bold, to be brave, to be myself and to speak up. Belladonna taught me I should say it with my whole chest and stand on it, consequences be damned.

I tend to internalise my emotions a lot. For someone who talks as much as I do, I don’t really get into my emotions. That’s what all my songs give me—they give me the cathartic space to be honest and the solace that comes with that.

If you could sit in a room and watch people react to one line from the song for the first time, which line would you choose and why?

Depends on the people in the room at the time…

Some people might hear the lines in the second verse about Whiteheart and think, oh, she didn’t… And that would honestly be a lot of fun for me. I’m not even going to lie.

The most memorable songs often come from taking creative risks. What was the biggest risk you took with this release?

This whole release and concept was a risk. I was very truthful and specific with the subject matter, for one.

But also, Belladonna needed to be its own thing. It’s not a conventional pop song. I lean into some pretty dark themes and dramatic imagery. My influences come from everywhere—grunge, rock, pop, film, fashion and pop culture—and Belladonna embraces all of that in one song rather than just choosing one lane.

I guess it would’ve been easier to release something “safer,” but this is who I am as an artist and I’m inviting people into my world. I didn’t dilute it to fit expectations, and I truly believe the right audience will connect with it.

How do you know when a song is emotionally honest enough to share with the world rather than just keep for yourself?

You know, that is a good question.

I always forget that I’m releasing these things into the world, so I always get this wave of anxiety before releasing, like I’m letting people into my diary or something.

But then I think, well, if I’m feeling like this, then maybe that’s something other people can see in themselves too. My experience might be personal, but the emotion is universal. I think once you have a song that can stand on its own and also invite other people into the feeling, it should be shared.

If someone discovers your music through Belladonna (This Is How You Die), what do you hope they understand about Sasha Summers before the song ends?

That I’m not really interested in following a formula and that my music is about creating a world, not just releasing songs.

That I am an artist who loves to embrace contrasts. Belladonna lives in this space of darkness and glamour, vulnerability and strength, and also grit and beauty.

So if someone finishes Belladonna and they want to step further into my world, then I’ve done my job.

What excites you most about where your music is heading right now that fans haven’t seen yet?

Sorry, firstly… “fans”? Me?! My 15-year-old self would sob hearing that, let me tell you.

I will say that I am very excited for fans to realise that these songs aren’t just isolated moments in time. With every release, people will begin to put together little connections between the songs, stories and themes.

Right now, they’re just getting to know me and seeing the beginning of the picture. I’m just so excited to invite them deeper into my world.

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How did the idea of turning your inner critic into a character come about, and what did you discover about yourself through that process?

Firstly, I love these questions – they’re so big! I’m wondering how to answer this without giving away all my secrets! The concept of internal characters is something I’ve been thinking about for a while now. I absolutely adore the movie Inside Out, which I think could explain this better than I can, but this song comes from a similar place. A lot of my songwriting explores pieces of my identity a bit more cryptically, but with Alice, I decided it would be fun to quite literally build a character. I imagined my inner critic as a best friend/frenemy, and the song illustrates this dysfunctional partnership story, as though we can never get to the bottom of who’s in charge. We fight like crazy, but deep down, we each need something that the other has to offer.

There’s a real sense of release running through Alice Says. Was there a particular moment in your life that pushed you to stop listening to fear and start trusting your creative instincts?

I would say not one moment, but many little moments, and I definitely still listen to fear a LOT! I think, though, I’ve found that the more I trust, choose and practice creativity, the more comfortable I get with the uncertainty that comes with it. And generally speaking, each time I’ve done something that feels brave and scary, it’s led to something else really magical – so that helps too.

You’ve described the song as a conversation between different parts of yourself. Has your relationship with that fearful voice changed since writing the track?

For sure – in a way, this song was the perspective shift I needed. Rather than fighting, burying or running away from it, I got a bit more curious about why this fear is here, where did it start and what it is teaching me. Somehow, creating a silly character made this much easier to unpack!

The song leans into a much louder, more distorted sound than some of your previous work. What was it like stepping into that more unapologetic side of your artistry?

The most fun!! I have lots of ideas in my head for big, bold, energetic sounds, but because I so often write sitting quietly at the piano with a cup of tea, I’ve struggled to translate that into my songwriting. A very clever mentor suggested I change my environment and try writing with a sense of playfulness, so before I wrote this song, I actually put on some rock songs, jumped around the house a bit, then picked up the guitar. It was very cool to see that if I change my energy beforehand, it can open a different creative door.

Working with Oscar Dawson seems to have encouraged some creative risk-taking. What did he bring to the project that helped unlock the energy of the song?

Oscar is a master translator. I am honestly in awe; it’s a crazy skill. I’m a mostly self-taught musician, and that can feel really limiting when I don’t have the right words or references or technical tools to describe the sounds I’m imagining, or create them myself. Oscar has a really incredible way of understanding how a song should feel in order to deliver its message, whether that’s through words, instruments or energy. This song needed to feel a bit messy and a bit scruffy, which is always a challenge for me as a reforming perfectionist, but through some combination of storytelling, overdrive pedals and amp sims, we unlocked a new level!

You’ve spoken about the original lyrics being far more confrontational. What made you decide that understanding your fears was more important than fighting them?

I think there’s a lot we can learn from our fears. I suppose at the end of the day, they’re just trying to keep us safe, and if we ignore them, they can get more persistent. A lot of my fears are tied up with being a performer, which feels kinda strange when it’s also the thing that I love doing the most. But I’ve found the more I understand where the fear is coming from, the easier it is to keep moving forward – like I’m saying ‘I hear you, but I’m going to do this anyway, and I think it’ll be okay’.

Your songwriting often feels very honest and personal. Do you ever worry about revealing too much of yourself, or has vulnerability become a strength in your creative process?

All the time! But it’s also probably my favourite thing, finding the thread of a feeling, unravelling it, then piecing it back together into something new that’s a little bit raw and maybe a little bit sparkly. I love that vulnerability can create such potent moments of connection and understanding. I’ve felt this myself at concerts when an artist shares something so honest that it rocks you to your core in the best possible way.

So far, it’s always been the songs I’m most nervous to write or share that have led to the most special connections with listeners and audiences, and I think it’s so cool that songs can bring people together like that.

After earning recognition as a Top Global Emerging Songwriter in the Vanda & Young competition, has that validation changed the way you approach writing and releasing music?

More than anything, it has just made me really excited to share everything I’ve been working on. It’s a competition I’ve applied to almost annually since I was a teenager, and it was always a way to keep myself accountable and watch my songwriting grow from year to year. I never had any expectations, but the song I submitted this year is one that felt really, really special – to find out that it resonated so strongly was pretty amazing. I’m now wrangling with wanting to share everything immediately right this second, and wanting to do my bigger vision justice, but it’s a fun time either way.

You first saw Kim Churchill perform as a teenager, and now you’re sharing a stage with him. Does that experience make you reflect on how far you’ve come in your own journey?

It’s a very surreal dream come true moment, for sure. My dad took me to see Kim when he played in my hometown, and it was probably the first time I realised that you could really just go out and forge your own path in music, instead of waiting for some mystical industry person to choose you, and also that there are so many different ways a music career can look. There were a lot of detours for me between then and now, including a long period where I’d stopped playing music altogether, but being able to play alongside Kim now makes me so grateful that I found my way back.

As this single introduces a new chapter in your sound, what excites you most about what listeners are going to hear from you next?

This song is just one piece of a very intricate puzzle I’ve been building for the last few years. There’s definitely still a familiar link back to my old work and writing style, but I’ve been able to explore a new depth in my sound, which has been really fulfilling. I love a good mystery, so I’m probably most excited about getting to reveal little surprises one piece at a time (and perhaps, more characters too!)

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Growing Pains transforms your life story into a theatrical experience. At what point did you realise your journey was powerful enough to become a story for the stage rather than simply another chapter in your career?

When I returned to the stage after a long 4 year battle with mental health issues, I wanted to create a show that was real, raw and connected with the audience on a deep level. Through that, I’d weave life stories in amongst my songs only to be told after the show that I should write a book. The notion almost felt self-indulgent until I started to see the idea more of an exchange of experience and knowledge rather than a “boast”. Writing a book still seems a little premature, so I decided to create a story-telling theatre experience that shares first hand the experiences that have shaped me as a human being.

When developing the narrative for Growing Pains, were there moments from your life that were difficult to revisit because they still carried emotional weight?

Absolutely. I had to dig up parts of my past that I had buried – Traumas battling childhood Leukemia along with my darkest mental health episodes. As hard as it is to share these experiences in the first-person, it’s also helped me to understand myself a little more – Not just the tough stuff but the good!

The production covers everything from childhood fame to personal struggles and reinvention. How did you decide which parts of your story absolutely had to be included and which parts were left out?

It all came down to two questions.. “What do I want people to get out of this?” and “How do I want them to feel?” I knew I didn’t want a surface level nostalgic trip – I wanted people to walk away not only feeling entertained, but inspired and maybe a little bit more understood. I also wanted the emotional journey of the show to reflect the magnitude of life lived. As dark as what it has been, I’ve had some incredibly joyous and wonderous experiences and at times, some hilarious ones!!! (Thank you puberty!).

What was it like seeing your life structured as a story with a beginning, middle and end? Did it change the way you view your own journey?

Doing work on yourself can often involve self-reflection but not like this. Seeing, performing, reliving this part of my life had me pausing many times. Sometimes that pause would be to release emotions like sadness or anger and other times it was a simple, “Damn, I can’t believe I lived that experience??!!!”. Many of us “next” our way through life and rarely take time to sit and reflect on the our lived experiences. It’s profound when you do!

Theatre audiences often connect most strongly with vulnerability. Was there a particular scene or chapter in Growing Pains that pushed you furthest outside your comfort zone as a storyteller?

Definitely the traumas of getting a lumbar puncture as a seven year old. That’s a real tough one to relive on stage and that whole segment ties in with a such a magical and popular memory on TV of me. It’s brutal in the way it reveals the duality between being a performer whilst battling a life threatening disease and the sense of purpose and magic that sparks when those two paths come together.

Music has always been the way you’ve communicated with audiences. How different was it telling your story through spoken word and narrative compared to letting the songs do the talking?

I’ve done lots of workshops, keynotes and shared stories in between songs but this is very different. I’m fully re-living them on stage with the songs used as punctuations not as the base of the show. I won’t lie. I feel more exposed up there than what I ever have.

Many people know Nathan Cavaleri the guitarist, but what side of Nathan the person do you hope audiences discover through Growing Pains?

A side that maybe mirrors in some way themselves. Many of our challenges are exacerbated by the false belief that we are alone with them. But really, we all live our own unique lives but fundamentally, we all have so much in common. I get a lot of comfort out of knowing that I’m not the only one struggling at times, and when wins are felt by others who “get it”, it makes it all the more special!

The show explores some incredibly personal themes, including identity, anxiety and resilience. What conversations are you hoping audiences have on the drive home after seeing the production?

That there are many paths “home” and sometimes the most promoted or even socially accepted way, is not the right one. That possibilities are less limited than what we’re told. For people to see their own challenges as puzzles rather than “wrongs” to battle – How much failure teaches us. Even learning how to laugh again at ourselves! Every time I hear someone’s story, I’m able to self-reflect with a new perspective that opens my world up. I’d love this show to be the catalyst for that!

If someone walks into the theatre knowing nothing about your career, what do you hope they take away from Growing Pains beyond the music itself?

Sorry I blended these two questions together.

After turning your life into a theatre production, did you learn anything new about yourself that surprised you during the creative process?

A few things…. That without realising, I saw myself through the eyes of a small minority who used to put me down. For that reason, I didn’t see or feel the love and therefore assumed, everybody had the same negative opinions about me.

It reaffirms how my pains have been my greatest teacher and that very rarely can we make sense of them until they become memories.

And how courageous I must have been when I was 14 years old, to go on stage in front of the same girls who hijacked my privacy to watch me go to the toilet. Yeah. It’s been long enough that I can tell that story publicly and laugh about it!

GROWING PAINS – THE NATHAN CAVALERI STORY
Tickets available from www.nathancavaleri.com

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